Nonconformity - Discussions, questions

astroboi77 I don´t think there is such a thing as a conforming sign. Whether someone is a conformist or not depends on their Uranus placement.

Gemini´s don´t like being stagnant & love their freedom and Capricorn´s (as serious + strict as they may seem) often like breaking the status quo for their own benefit.

Cancer & Taurus seem pretty conformist to me. Though. Mostly because they like staying home and not getting out of their comfort or hedonistic zone.

Anni23 Depends who we are "conforming" for? If it´s worth fitting into as you say a system which doesn´t work to benefit good people. Then my loyalty as a Leo is quite frankly wasted.. and gets huffy and my mercury in cancer may turn to black humor 😂 and my Virgo moon is not amused
But yeah.. in terms of internally disagreeing with many people as a Virgo moon I am not easily impressed by shit, and I have 9th house activity which also sniffs at the crap going on around me lol

Actually cancers are often outsiders, and Leo´s proud (not necessarily arrogant) but knowing having dignity of self is the only solution

Oh also though I have my sun in the 11th house lol
And 12th house placements of course create the outsider sigh..

The most conformist persons I know personally are a aqua with Venus in Capricorn and a Capricorn with a libra moon and mercury in Aquarius actually

The thing about aquas though is I think they like social structures/systems that are created to bring people together, regardless of whatever those structures are.

Also in terms of wanting to "fit in" to a group the two people above but also Sag-Scorpios, they are ALL over the political or religious affiliation act. But also they will go against everyone else in society to keep their defiant beliefs

People who generally don´t want to fit in at all I think are most often Aries or maybe Scorpio, although not sure about that last one. Also pisces is kind of inbetween, I mean often they seem outsiders as they don´t know how to be.. well normal lol

ram_goat Lillith and Uranus placements are the first things I look at...

both rebel against the status-quo.

..and anyone who does want to conform to it is slightly delusional.

I fight with this thought myself. I have also battled another uncomfortable thought, within my own mind, from time to time- that the nonconformists too, are slightly delusional.. how much of my own utopian weirdness, or inner non-conformity could the world really accept? Keep & hold? Not much,
I suspect. It´s a tricky thing to balance in one´s own personality.

One´s own need for liberty must always be balanced opposite other´s need
for the same, in whatever degree they experience it or need it in their own personality. Physical space and distance usually enter into the picture here, as well.. each person needs a bit between themselves and others to express their own individuality in socially acceptable ways.

leorising I, as a chiron and lilith at 11, realize that the system aims to protect men, because things can only exist with their approval. I also see that the system protects the family. I was able to develop myself ( healing my wounds) and then receive validation, but I realize that many people are deceived by quick validation and get stuck in the ego game. my family has not been validated and it is a minefield, I think it is horrible, seeing people and not being able to access them.

Wolfmoon Aries Sun, Aqua Asc, Uranus in my 11th.

I view the world in a way that is unique... I crave knowledge around humanity, philosophy, history and anything as to why we´re in this current paradigm.

I see everything in our modern structure as a form of evil and if I want to be true to myself and the nature of man, I refuse to comply.

I was recently told I have the makings of a revolutionary in my chart... which wouldn´t surprise me haha

My whole life up until my Sat return I lived a "normal" life but I constantly questioned it. It never felt right.

"anyone who does want to conform to it is slightly delusional."

Agreed. Prisoners of comfort.

"I would rather walk alone than with the crowd walking in the wrong direction"

ram_goat » Wolfmoon It´s great to realize these things about yourself- that realization marks the
first steps on the road to wisdom.

But living those insights to their fullest will require patience, quietness of soul, and an acceptance of human nature as it is (if not an acceptance of conditions as they are..), and great circumspection.

Too much, too fast, is always the danger here. Our minds are much freer and move much quicker than the world does. The state of our thoughts and ideals are usually at odds with the current state of the world at any given moment.

The dark side of all things Uranian- it gives insight but also this impulse to flip over tables and overturn things, which is not always the wisest or best course of action at any given time.

The best Uranian types throughout history combine a certain calmness of mind and fixity of purpose and tenacity in achieving their deeper goals. Rare indeed, as this energy is quite impulsive. But the flip side of the revolutionary nature of Uranus is a humanitarian one, and sometimes the most humane thing you can do is allow change to come with as little trauma and upheaval as possible.

LotusStar I relate to everything you wrote.

I have a 11 house Sun/stellium Virgo square Uranus in Sagittarius, and also Pluto rising which can be a lone wolf. Lilith on my Mc. I´m difficult to control.

I have gone against the grain to stay true to my values and standards, even at the cost of being outcast from certain social groups. The big thing for me is I want to think for myself, I´m allergic to hive mind manipulation and someone trying to tell me what to think, especially when it doesn´t make sense and doesn´t feel true and just because "authority said so".

I think positively Uranus definitely brings that kind of free-thinker energy, refusal to bow down to authority and populism "just because".

But, it´s not always been easy for me to because I am earth dominant, and earth energy does need a certain level of security and stability also. If I was more fiery I would probably be more bold in this, with it being a square, it feels like more of an internal struggle at times on where to draw the line.

rohini moon » ram_goat But living those insights to their fullest will require patience, quietness of soul, and an acceptance of human nature as it is (if not an acceptance of conditions as they are..), and great circumspection.


You´re speaking Lord Buddha realization now.

"Spiritual progress depends on the emergence of five cardinal virtues — faith, vigor, mindfulness, concentration and wisdom. The conduct of the ordinary worldling is governed by his sense-based instincts and impulses. As we progress, new spiritual forces gradually take over, until in the end the five cardinal virtues dominate and shape everything we do feel and think. These virtues are called, in Sanskrit and Pali, indriya, variously translated by faculties, controlling faculties, or spiritual faculties.[1] The same five virtues are called powers (bala) if emphasis is on the fact that they are "unshakable by their opposites."

ram_goat » rohini moon Wow! Beautifully said..

fishscales With Uranus conjunct ascendant and moon in Aquarius, I get the whole non-conformist thing.

But what I really think is valuable about those aspects now is that as I´ve gotten older, they´ve caused me to reflect on the whole non-conformity thing, and only be a non-conformist when it makes real sense to do so, or when it´s attached to a deep conviction... I´ve developed quite a disdain for "Rebel without a cause" attitudes, or "going against for the sake of going against"...

I´ve also realized that internal freedom is the most important thing...I can, for the most part, accept the system and work with it, all while thinking it´s a complete load of crap...

This is something my mom always tried to teach me...you can play the game to your own benefit...but you don´t have to buy into it...

It doesn´t mean you´re a sellout...just learning how to master life...

So maybe I´m a post-non-conformity nonconformist..

SaturnineMoonchild » ram_goat "One´s own need for liberty must always be balanced opposite other´s need for the same"
"sometimes the most humane thing you can do is allow change to come with as little trauma and upheaval as possible."

If I could take a Sharpie to your posts and underline these points in bright red, I would do so.
Very well said.

leorising » fishscales wow how I wanted to talk to your mother, this is the way I intend to go on with my life, to be validated but not to use it to diminish anyone or find myself superior than others. I see this superiority thing being injected into women and they fall such as ducks.

rohini moon » ram_goat If you think about it, Buddha himself was the true definition of a "non-conformist"

How many people would renounce a life of riches and literally all they could ask for, in order to seek the higher realization?

Born Siddhartha, into a royal family as a Prince, had a father - King Suddodana, who at the time of Lord Buddha´s birth hired 108 (yes, lol) of the best astrologers in India to dissect out Buddha´s chart. His fathers only concern regarding that, or, wish, I should say, was that Buddha take over after him and become King.

One astrologer said (who later wound up becoming a prominent disciple of Buddhas) his chart could go either way, BUT, if he does not choose the life of a King, he would be a great Holy man. King Suddodana also was relayed the ways in which he was able to shield Buddha from renouncing his royal life up until he was 29. (What major transit do people go through at age 29? We all know the answer here.) At age 29, he left the Palace, for the first time and saw all the miseries of the world, that in his life of riches never knew existed. It bothered him so much, he wanted nothing more to do with this earthly existence... He wanted a way out. To find Moksha. In his words they have said he declared: ´This life is ephemeral"

So, he renounced all his riches, his throne, gave away all of his gold to every servant before taking to the forest to live the life of an Ascetic.

All that to say, in my eyes, Lord Buddha is the most honest, and truest from of non-conformity, I have ever heard of.

Astro-Seek.com System message: Post has been written by user Fool, who already deleted profile on this website:
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"The dark side of all things Uranian- it gives insight but also this impulse to flip over tables and overturn things, which is not always the wisest or best course of action at any given time."

This made me recall an incident in kindergarten (infants school); to this day I can´t recall what but I did something in class (or said something) and was promptly put in an empty class (to calm the fuck down I suppose). So enraged was I at this treatment that I flipped over a few tables and chairs; I recall the sting of injustice (still don´t know what it was) as I sat and seethed and then, abruptly calmed down and put the tables and chairs back where they were supposed to be. Conformity and rebelliousness all in one afternoon, very tiring.

It was an interesting moment I did feel, briefly, that a calmer me had descended or taken the driver´s seat for awhile. Shame they didn´t pick up the borderline
personality disorder from my antics - life may have gone a different way. You are right, dear readers, I should have set fire to the classroom.

leorising » Fool You are right, dear readers, I should have set fire to the classroom.

Astro-Seek.com System message: Post has been written by user Fool, who already deleted profile on this website:
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Yes, Aquarians are the first port of call when it comes to this question. I have that more conformist (if you want to put it like that) Aqua vibe as well as the - which we could say represented the more trad interpretation of the rebellious Aqua. It can get busy.

Uranus is riding high in the 10th - I don´t see myself as rebellious - just not much of a joiner (although I have been involved in environmental projects - raising cash, etc for Friends of the Earth, local Greenpeace among others)I never joined. Now you may attribute contrariness to that - sometimes it is - but primarily its a self-defense mechanism to stay away - mostly - from meetings where you may upset the apple-cart for the wrong reason. Mostly, but not always, I am or have been the shoot yourself in the foot kind of contrarian.

Users who may fit the bill (just through their posts) are: Revloc, refining his shit all the time (your kids may be wearing a t-shirt with an image of him ready to throw a Molotov - very ´Banksy") Sunny (we may, in the future have to put a hit out on this guy - stop him taking over the world); RohiniMoon - not going to elaborate just don´t eff with her FishScales - he´s a wrong un, too. Pretty much everyone on this site is a non-conformist to some degree (is the study of Astrology still considered an oddball pastime?) and it can manifest in so many mundane ways.

fishscales » Fool "(is the study of Astrology still considered an oddball pastime?)"

Interesting that non-conformity and astrology can both be said to be ruled by the same planet...

rohini moon » Fool Pretty much everyone on this site is a non-conformist to some degree (is the study of Astrology still considered an oddball pastime?) and it can manifest in so many mundane ways.

That was my initial thought, but I didn´t say it. Heh.

I think people can take this forum for granted, I have used forums many many moons ago (we´re talking back in the early 00´s) and they were even strict back then with what you can and cannot say/post. Admins, moderators, deleting people all the time for tom foolery (the kind that wasn´t warranted) here, Petr lets us have a voice to speak our minds. no matter what they may be. And yes, not all of us always agree, and I think it would be boring if we all did. You can take a lot from some of the users here. Some times they even surprise you.

Id say to anyone here, go and find another astrology forum or forum in general that would give you as much freedom as is allowed here.

fishscales » Fool "Mostly, but not always, I am or have been the shoot yourself in the foot kind of contrarian."

Yes...I have been this too.

I think it mellows with age, experience, and a little more thinking.

You start to question those Uranian tendencies/attitudes/pursuits and sift out which ones have real purpose, and which ones are just fattening the ego...

Still...its good to know that Uranian recalcitrance can be tapped into when it is needed...

Astro-Seek.com » fishscales System message: Post has been written by user Fool, who already deleted profile on this website:
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Interesting, yeah but in the Chinese way (interesting times) ; the more I think about the less I want to comply.

Astro-Seek.com » fishscales System message: Post has been written by user Fool, who already deleted profile on this website:
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Yes, you certainly do mellow with it (thankfully) in time and I like the sifting analogy. When I think of the times that I may have been the rebellious Aquarian, I do find it hard to justify my actions, mostly. Contrariness for the sake of it. Tapped into or leaking out a bit is fine I just don´t want it taking my addled sense ´away´.

Astro-Seek.com » rohini moon System message: Post has been written by user Fool, who already deleted profile on this website:
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Here, here! Take a bite of chewin´ tobacco.

Astro-Seek.com » Fool System message: Post has been written by user Fool, who already deleted profile on this website:
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I have an exemplar of the more conformist type. My Uncle Peter (passed away last year a month after his wife); sociable (no flamin´ diatribes or uncomfortable points/convos) could speak with anyone (age group), frustrated comedian, saved hundreds and hundreds of lives in his career as an Ambulance driver. Never talked about it, was never the ´ego´ in the room and was always ready to help anyone. The only thing I am aware of that may have been considered oddball was his fondness for making wine (his tea wine was good) and his love of steam trains and buses. RIP Uncle Peter and Aunt Cora.

rohini moon If the system was viable and healthy, I dont think I would have as much of an issue with conforming to it.

The system was never meant to be that. That would be too easy for the masses. They aren´t concerned with making any of our lives "easier" - quite the opposite actually. They want the masses in a constant state of fear and or uncertainty.. With that mind frame, humans are much easier to control. I.E. Propagandize.

Astro-Seek.com » leorising System message: Post has been written by user Fool, who already deleted profile on this website:
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Ooh, I´m a bad lad