suicide - Discussions, questions

AlsaceTX » nutelina Thank you to all for your condolences. It is a shame, but it was their chosen path. They are probably reincarnated right now, saying "aww shit...gotta do dis again"

It´s a serious and sad issue. One, I believe, carries Karma that must be cleansed. But we cannot really die, so it´s just part of their learning journey.

I miss my younger brother the most. Quite possible the most intelligent human being I have ever interacted with...by FAR.

No, they did not facilitate my astrological / spiritual / tarot journey. That was having Neptune cross my mid-heaven & Jupiter over the last two years. HELLO.

JayJayAstrology » Doodle926 Oh yes. Well your post did not mention chronic physical pain. So my response was an assumed one. Truly, physical pain is a tough one. Many good people have committed suicide due to physical pain. If it cannot be healed, and there is no remedy, life does not seem worth living. I have great sympathy for anyone in that position. Some people also have extreme emotional pain that is difficult to remedy.

I do think that most people with depression can work through it - but, I do think there are those who cannot - and I for one, would never judge another who chooses to end chronic pain . . .

You are right. We put animals out their misery when we expect people to live with unbelievable pain with no end in sight. If I were in unbearable pain and my quality of life was poor and non-existent, I would like to die with dignity without judgment.

ancient_astrology Not knowing anything else, I would not consider a Saturn return to the 8th in Aquarius a sign of suicide. I would need to look at the Solar Return chart and the rest of the chart. Saturn would be in its own domicile in Aquarius. That´s why I tend to doubt it, but a lot depends on whether it is a night or day chart. Night chart would be worse.

One of the greatest signifiers of suicide in terms of the natal chart tends to be an instance where the ruler of the first is a malefic( Mars, Saturn) and it finds itself in the twelfth. Or vice-versa, the ruler of the 12th is a malefic (Mars, Saturn) and it finds itself in the first. Of course, that´s a general statement, and it all comes down to seeing the whole chart and how those planets are helped or hurt by other factors, such as dignities and aspects.

In short, need to see the chart.

JayJayAstrology A Saturn Return in any sign or house cannot cause contemplating suicide. It can provide some stress that can add to feelings of depression already there if the person isn´t able to process the energy. But that is true of many transits that are not received well. The stress is not caused by the planets but the person´s response to the planetary energy. No placement of any planet can cause a person to feel depressed unless the consciousness is predisposed to feeling depressed already.

Depression is a mental-emotional state. It isn´t permanent - that is - it is a state of mind that can change. Our charts are where we left off in the past life or our family heritage and we are supposed to grow from there. When people feel deeply depressed, they feel hopeless or hope against all hope - like it cannot change and they see no way out of it. It just feels like a deep, dark hole that is impossible to climb out of. Then thinking about suicide provides a relief because it is a way out. However, that deeply stuck feeling that there is no way out of it is only a perception and feeling state - one of many possible feeling states - and not the truth.

Depression is largely caused by wanting to be seen and heard and connected while feeling disconnected and not seen and heard. The person feels isolated and alone. Often, depressed people have a good deal of repressed emotion or feelings that they don´t even know they have - and some relief can come from exploring their inner life.

You have North Node of the Moon in the 8th house, so this says, you do need to explore your inner life - to become aware of feelings - to take responsibility for them. If you blame other people or events for how you feel, then you aren´t owning them. Of course, there are people and events that can make our lives miserable, but regardless, the only thing we can change is ourselves. If we want to change, we have to take responsibility for how we feel - even if we can rightly blame a person or event for causing it. In the end, all we can do is work on ourselves and then there is hope that our lives can change.

I do recommend getting counseling. I did at one point and it was the best thing I had ever done to that point. A good therapist or counselor is a good model and guide through necessary self-exploration. You are a sensitive person and someone who needs confidence building through relationship. You tend to be hypercritical of yourself. This can be worked with. You can change the way you talk to yourself and feel better. You need to use your good imagination to strengthen pictures of a healthier you.

Your chart suggests that you feel like an outsider - and in some ways - I bet you are. But, that is true for many people - and there are positive avenues in which to express your talents and be appreciated even if you´re different. Those of us who have struggled with depression and who have emerged from it - know that it is something that can actually make you stronger in the end. There are always positive lessons to walk away with - and the crown of victory when you emerge on top and glowing in the light. Even if we can analyze how a person can be depressed in a chart, we can also analyze a whole other scenario in the same chart. There are positive and negative responses to all planetary energies. The goal is to turn the negative responses into positive ones.

Anti-depressants are top sellers on the pharma market. You are surrounded with people fighting depression and thoughts of suicide. For that, I thank you for your post. It was a brave thing to do and I hope you´ve inspired others to be open about it. I´ve been there and I came out of it, so I speak from experience. It is also called the dark night of the soul. We all have the capacity do feel deeply depressed and suicidal. It´s part of human nature. There´s absolutely no shame in it. Exploring the dark side provides an deeper understanding of ourselves and others. But we don´t have to remain there forever. We are much more than that.
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Avvii P » goldenlion32 I definitely agree with you. I´ve come to realize the world is a selfish place. And it´s inhabitants like to make you believe they are but their not. Don´t get me wrong, a few people are absolutely unselfish and no what it means to be that way but most people aren´t. Ans it´s very frustrating. I can sorta relate to it cause I have south node in the 1st house with North node in the 7th. I also have uranus, neptune amd venus in my 7th. Sometimes I wish I didn´t because focusing on others and trying to help develop them while they don´t give a shit about you or your emotions or your mental well-being is.. not a nice feeling. But I still try to make an effort, this time tho without being a doormat.

Avvii P » Ioaanaa08 Been doing that. Thank you for the advice though.

Astro-Seek.com » AlsaceTX System message: Post has been written by user AIP, who already deleted profile on this website:
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I am deeply sorry for your losses.

nutelina » AlsaceTX I´m sorry for your loss. Did you become interested in astrology and tarot after they died?

goldenlion32 » Avvii P It is difficult to say. I think you have to have the right cocktail of transits influencing the birth chart. And perhaps all about what coping methods, techniques, tools, and the thoughts one is having at the time.

I think there are windows of opportunity, but it´s a deliberate choice to give into those thoughts, emotions, and feelings, whether those individuals are consciously aware of it or not.

I theorize at times as well if some individuals do have some kind of past life where they´ve done this before, and return to heal once more until their soul finally figures out it´s not staying in that Scorpio realm of Pluto and destruction.

We can even see this in the physical as some individuals will repeatedly attempt suicide, yet, they´re souls don´t exit. And they´re forced to confront those wounds and heal them and liberate themselves.

Then you have some who leave the earth. And it might be a soul contract with those individuals to promote a humanitarian cause, speak about suicide.

Then you have those who have succeeded, but come back and then speak about the experience. Then heal completely, and help others heal.

Hard to say, since there are so many stories.

Since I´ve been in the Netherlands, there was a teen, they allowed to exit and it was kind of frustrating for me, because I am a spiritual person, and I really don´t like Euthanasia. And while I understand some individuals have incurable diseases, I don´t know if I´d want that responsibility to say whether someone lives or dies.

And this teen was suffering from some Mental Health issues, but as a teen how many are really going to have the coping skills? So of course, it seemed very cruel, since she might have thought quite differently in ten to twenty years, who knows, but they just agreed to let her go because it was easier then letting her grow up and perhaps technology right now would have helped her.

Suicide has so much to do with thoughts, beliefs, and what one is told from family, friends, romantic/sexual partners, the medical/mental health community, the stigma, the controversy with Alternative methods, techniques, and tools. And it seems it kind of is "Karma" in a sense, because is Karma is your thoughts, actions, and words. When we do not understand the huge impact we have on one another in society with what we say and do. The power of words can be used in positive and negative ways.

And this is why I don´t like the theory of "Give Zero Fucks" and "It´s not my problem or not my issue." I hear all the time online. I hear. "I"m not responsible for your emotions, thoughts, and feelings." And I wonder if people really comprehend what they´re say hearing in depth.

"I devalue your life, your existence, your experience." and "I only value mine." and "You should of course value my life, my existence, my experience."

And it´s a mixed message. It´s saying "I" in the 1st house is more valuable than "You" in the 7th house. And it really is disturbing the last seven years watching this happen online where "I" is so significant, that it doesn´t matter if someone is suicidal. There was even one women who was charged with her boyfriend suicide, because she had a lot of text messages with him and told him to go ahead and do it. And I´ve seen this so many times online.

I think this was the case.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/…

Ioaanaa08 My sister is entering her saturn return in aquarius 8th house
So your friend is a cancer rising
They tend to be more sensitive then most people and dramatic
Her moon is there too but she is a positive person
So it has nothing to do with it


What you can do for your friend is to make sure he /she knows how loved their are

Avvii P » goldenlion32 True. But it´s so interesting that astrologers can show why someone can commit suicide but not when.

goldenlion32 I had known someone who had did this in their Saturn Aquarius Return. Fortunately, I don´t know what house it was in simply because I don´t have his chart.

I think you´d have to look at the whole chart and how it aspects planets in the birth chart and also the current transits when it occurs.

If the influence is there, I´m not sure all the time the feminine and masculine are strong enough to withstand the energies. It depends on their traumatic wounds, their coping skills, their family support, what their ruminating and dwelling on at the time. There´s a lot of multiple factors involved for the event to occur besides transits and the influence on the chart.

IIyyaarr13 15 dg. of the cardinal signs gives musicality and suicidal tendency, 15 has my Vertex so it adds to the weird music!:
25 dg. of fixed signs is alcoholic and suicidey so it can give a meaning to the word "wasted"
26 dg. mutables is suicidey so there are all three modalities that can have leanings.
It is well-known that the fairer gender contemplates suicide out-loud for theatre!; 13 dg. negative mutables and 23 dg. positive cardinals.

Avvii P » Cynicaphy Oh my gosh I am so sorry. Is everything OK now?? Cause I definitely understand family problems that seem awful. This is especially with parental figures. I have my sun square pluto, sun opposite moon, moon opposite saturn and moon square pluto... Not the most loving place. Kinda almost abusive.

Avvii P » AlsaceTX A friend. And I am very sorry to hear about your brothers. Mental health is something so important that most people are too selfish to give one shit about. But some people have been experiencing the same problems for 20 years and when looking at a transit, realize that it´s never getting better. That´s not a short term problem.

Astro-Seek.com System message: Post has been written by user Cynicaphy, who already deleted profile on this website:
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I agree. Not one placement can dictate thoughts of suicide, but harsh transits resulting in difficult circumstances can definitely trigger unhappy emotions leading to thoughts of suicide.

Heavy Saturn transits can be depressing though. I remember Saturn transiting my Moon, and I had so many problems going on around my family life that I wanted to kill myself.

AlsaceTX I do not believe there is one placement / aspect / or transit that is an indicator of suicide. Harsh aspects involving Neptune / 12th house might be an indicator of mental instability.

Suicide is a long term solution to short term problems in most cases. It´s never the right answer in my opinion. And this is coming from someone who lost both his brothers to suicide: 2014 and 2018.

Do you for a friend? or yourself?