Tropical and sidereal - how to reconcile?

June 8, 2022 at 22:03 (UT/GMT)
(Gemini) tommasofabozzii
Tropical and sidereal - how to reconcile?
Anyone thought about or studied how to reconcile the two zodiacs?
Is one of the two the right one or are they different aspects of the same matter?
I wonder if one is more indicative of the Sun energy (tropical because it follows the solar calendar) and the other is more related to the constellations.
Looking for ideas to exchange and any article or study is welcomed.

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June 10, 2022 at 06:59
(Leo) TTTJJJ » tommasofabozzii
I myself follow some here and there and read texts online - i don´t have a specific book.
KRS usually speaks about general concepts (specially his old videos) so you can still learn and apply that on a tropical chart after all. The rest is left for you and your own experience (analyzing your chart and others around you)
June 9, 2022 at 23:52
(Gemini) tommasofabozzii » TTTJJJ
Thank you!
Can you suggest some sources to study?
I only know krs astrology on youtube for vedic and bits here and there for tropical.
June 9, 2022 at 22:46
(Leo) TTTJJJ » tommasofabozzii
Most welcome.

"The house systems is another matter that bugs me ahah I couldn´t even find info on why the midheaven changes position."

- MC changes position because it is a marker for the highest point for the sun in the sky (i.e. at noon) and we know that the sun´s elevation above the horizon at noon is highly dependent on the latitude of the place. Hence, Placidus house system can pose some problems for people born in higher latitudes because the angle between AC and MC then is quite small (check the database of astro-seek for people born in Finland or Sweden for example, specially in winter months).

"But back to the original question I thought about your first answer and thought that maybe it´s not the minute detail that counts in astrology but mainly how you interpret it."

- For a big part of it, I believe yes. It is how you see through the chart and I guess this what differentiates between one astrologer and another. However, each discipline has basics after all that need understanding.

"Still I wonder if a renewal of astrology is possible, like to make order among all the different methods. Or maybe I will just find what works for me."

- You will find what works for you as go along. Schools of astrology are there for a reason AND they are varied like the variation of people needs.

"The thing that moved me to pose this question is that if there are different methods then the whole discipline loses validity, but maybe its not like that."

- It´s all valid because many techniques and schools under astrology, whether Western, Hellenistic (traditional) or Vedic, all are tried, and if the failure probability is high for any system of those, surely people would have lost interest in them. As one astrologer put it: Astrology is a sea, no one can reach its end. However, nowadays, astrology is a merge of old school beliefs in some way and new methods of research and comparison, so it is kind of an upgrade or an update for the whole study (whatever school it is). Unlike the ancient texts where the talk about astrology was quite often merged with nature and philosophy beside religion and probably with not much studies and comparisons for charts of real individuals. You can see this clearly in the inherited terms such as "benefic" and "malefic" which automatically delivers "good" and "bad" into people´s minds. Modern astrological studies and comparison focuses more on the energies of planets at one point; Venus, for example, which is a benefic can at some point signal an addiction problem. Mars on the other hand, which is branded as "malefic" (i.e. bad) can at some point signal sharp intelligence or vitality. Anyway, in a nutshell, with practice, one would find the proper methods he or she needs to practice in astrology. It just needs time.
June 9, 2022 at 21:57
(Gemini) tommasofabozzii » TTTJJJ
Wow thank you for the answer!

I already did some study as you suggested with my own chart and I´m actually using the same as you, tropical with whole sign.
And also using some Indian concepts like house to house.
The house systems is another matter that bugs me ahah I couldn´t even find info on why the midheaven changes position.

But back to the original question I thought about your first answer and thought that maybe it´s not the minute detail that counts in astrology but mainly how you interpret it.

Still I wonder if a renewal of astrology is possible, like to make order among all the different methods. Or maybe I will just find what works for me.

The thing that moved me to pose this question is that if there are different methods then the whole discipline loses validity, but maybe its not like that.
June 9, 2022 at 12:26
(Leo) TTTJJJ » tommasofabozzii
Not necessarily a planet would be pulled back to the previous sign in sidereal compared to tropical (my sun for example remains Leo in both systems). Also, as I said, there are many subsystems in sidereal, and some of these systems are Persian in origin and some are European even. So, sidereal is not necessarily a system found in India, but many astrologers and nations tried their hand with sidereal, as it is a trial to fix some issue with the zodiac (e.g. the uncircular orbit for the sun, or the Earth´s axis shift, or parallax).
June 9, 2022 at 12:20
(Leo) TTTJJJ » tommasofabozzii
I´m assuming you have an idea about the theory why there is tropical and sidereal calculations (and under sidereal there are many sub-systems).

The same thing goes with the house systems; There are many of them.

Things are validated by your own expertise and work with charts.

For example, I use Whole sign house system, and tropical, and I do apply some Vedic techniques on tropical, and I do get some fine results. Many objected to that.
On the other hand, many did analyze my chart using Placidus house system, and got some good results as well.
When I tried sidereal/Lahiri to analyze my own chart, some things were right and some didn´t click much with me.

At this point, as you work with charts and investigate and research, you will get some intuition about what works for you. Starting with your own chart is a good start I think. However, I recommend focusing on the basics and classics (i.e. the classical planets from sun to saturn) and the nodes. Forget about whats beyond saturn and all these asteroids for now and focus on the basics and compare analyses provided online (texts and youtube) for positions you have (and don´t forget the major aspects in your chart between planets). Make notes or comparisons between your findings using positions from both systems, and you will slowly get an idea what works best for you.

Edit: forgot to add, some astrologers suggested an explanation between the two systems as, tropical charts are about the current status and what the person is born with or the potential, and sidereal chart is about what the person yearns for or what should be achieving in life. It´s a suggestion but I didn´t investigate this possibility further.
June 9, 2022 at 12:15
(Gemini) tommasofabozzii
I thiught of merging them in this way:
Because they are now 1 sign apart this could make every sign be influenced by the previous sign.
So if I´m Gemini Sun this means I´m also a bit of Taurus Sun.

I also wonder if Indian astrology was theorized at the time that the zodiacs coincided or if its creation is further in time.
June 9, 2022 at 12:11
(Gemini) tommasofabozzii » TTTJJJ
Yeah sure now I´m using the tropical but I just can´t stand the theoretical gap.
How can they both be valid?
June 9, 2022 at 11:56
(Leo) TTTJJJ
All I can tell you here is, to pick one and keep on applying techniques and investigating charts using that system. Things will become clearer as you go on.


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