What dictates intelligence in a chart?

September 14, 2021 at 23:14 (UT/GMT)
(Sagittarius) Cosmette
What dictates intelligence in a chart?
What aspects do you commonly see? I thought about this for some time because I wondered why Virgo and Gemini were domicile in mercury. I noticed Aquarius mercuries seem very strong and intelligent, and that some Pisces mercuries I´ve met seem to have similar sister sign Virgo wit. So I figured just because mercury rules our general thought patterns, communication, etc. why is it that people who are intelligent seem to have different placements at times? Are there other factors, too? What do you think they are?

Sorry to anyone if this comes off as a silly question, but it would be interesting for me to understand, I´m a detriment mercury in Sagittarius, and my partner has his mercury domicile in Gemini, but we both seem very smart and communicative, loving to debate, and it got me thinking about what it means to have a domicile mercury, when other placements seem to perform well like Aries and Aquarius! I notice it seems that mars and uranus aspects to mercury seem to have some strokes of genius? (Especially uranus since it seems a trine to mercury is usually an aspect that gives us "brilliant" thinking? But what else exists? I´m curious to know!) Houses also! Lemme know whatcha think :^)

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September 18, 2021 at 18:28
(Aries) nutelina » Netyro
First of all what a wonderful thread. Thank You all.

As for philosophy of mathematics, I´d be very curious about that, is it about how to approach solving problems with maths?

As for Mercury being domicile in Gemini and Virgo I think is because Mercury is a quick planet and quick decision is what benefits this planet. Not the best of explanations but this is my interpretation of often less than satisfactory astrology explanations if you ask me. I studied mathematics for a few years yet I prefer to study o my own and I find computer science much better to study mathematics. I´m glad to take a practical approach instead of vague definitions but that´s perhaps an often heared complaint. I need to see things first, the language side of mathematics bothers me, I prefer to just know what it is about and then define it precisely. My Mercury in Pisces 9th house trine to late degree Jupiter in Cancer needs to go deep but also my Moon in Taurus trine Saturn makes me a diligent worker. But this all came later in life, I was way too impatient during my study and I did not want to spend all my time on it.

As for pure intelligence, and this has nothing to do with astrology, I believe and know this has to do with nutrition and health of the mother, being the first born and getting the nutrition you need without the crap like vaccines but that´s my personal experience which I researched heavily. Genes including race has a big impact too but all this is highly controversial.
September 17, 2021 at 15:23
(Taurus) Rosincvist
You have :154: on a Scientific Interest degree of the Zodiac; The climax of I.Q. tests´ usefulness is correlative with the mid-Twentieth century Scientific race between the Superpowers! The eighties had a trend of Psychologist wanting to broaden the I.Q. test from a small brief-case to a trunk of goodies that had gone neglected!
September 17, 2021 at 13:00
(Leo) Anni23 » Maiar
It is true that I have certain instincts/+ideals which I am sure I must have always had from an awareness of my sun. Such as dignity, loyalty, trust, kinship etc. I think that I have demonstrated these qualities it is true, though in a less overt way
Well you should know this too

I still dont know if my sun is in the 10th or 11th though

I agree that astrology should be based on a certain number of actual facts, just on here you see many opinions

That is very interesting what you say about the sun conjunct the moon, in what way "narrow", or just generally speaking these are people that decide what they believe and then dont really look any further?
Does this apply to sextiles between the sun and moon as well? I have known people with either sextiles or the same sun and moon who seem to possess some kind of easy identity and yet it never changes and I don´t think that they want it too because they decided long ago who they were and how they would see the world
September 17, 2021 at 11:50
(Leo) Maiar » Anni23
Lol, Interesting, Yes you do earn your Sun , BUT, You are born with a specific motivation towards your sun sign, Sun is not only the personality that we are striving to be and shine in the world, Most importantly it´s our vitality and energy at the highest level.

Virgo suns have vitality and energy in a virgo way, thats why they find it easy to show virgo traits to people, Leo Sun has high vitality in a leonine way,, which resembles the characteristics of the sun in astrology easily.

Every fiery planet adds huge energy and vitality to the native if placed well( Fire signs, aspects to personal planets)

1st houae sun mars or jupiter would make a native very energetic, even restless in general , in anything that requires physical activity ( mars rules 1st house)

Sun mars jupiter in 3rd house for exaple woupd make you talkative more than most people can handle( if mars is here u will have strong ,high voice with authoritative tone, verbally aggtessive without noticing) if sun is here you would be more patient but have more gas in the tank to last , you can speak slowly but forever. If jupiter is here you would be incredibly enthusiastic in your speach raising the positivity in the atmosphere.

Thats just an example of firey planets providing energy in a house, And they provide energy in each houae according to the traits of that house.

Yes, Houses do matter a lot especially sun and moon houses, And no it´s not a matter of opinion, It´s facts, Astrology is not opinion based, It has been gifted to us ,I believe it was sent by a prophet as a proof of god´s existence long time ago; But that´s just my guess,I´m Arabian , There are a lot of books on astrology, A lot of Arabian astrologers say that Astrology was sent from higher power to us thousands of years ago if not longer.

While i can´t confirm this by proof, I actually find it the most reasonable explanation.

The reason why i think this way is because if astrology was really true, And i believe it is based on experience, Then it must have been passed on to us by higher power ,wisdom and understanding that far exeeds human potential, Humans are great learning creatures, But they must recieve in order to learn.

As for Sun and cooperation, No it´s not meant to be that way for everyone, If they are conjunct trine or sextile, Thn yes, Cooperation is key, Otherwise , You are meant to have opposing traits and different qualities, You may find internal conflict, But you definitely have a wider view of life, Sun moon conjunction provides big smooth energy in a specific area of life, The downside however,Is that people having it tend to have a narrower view of life.

People exaggerate qbout Saturn return ,, Saturn has been there our entire life, Just like how u managed to survive some troubles you would again, It´s not like it´s aiming to kill u, no planet does that, They just provide energy that reaches earth, And since we are livong on earth we recieve it, We have choice and free will regardless of that energy.

I have a very strong Saturn in my chart, I´m certainly not afraid of it returning each and every day for that matter.

Because i believe in god and our life has meaning and our choices matter ,Free will is the test. What you do in this life you, Good or bad, You shall get in the after.
September 17, 2021 at 10:22
(Leo) Anni23 » Cosmette
Well yes that is my personal view too ☺

Anyone can know something about something. That´s a good attitude to have when encountering anyone.

Saggitarians and Leos I think are very similar, maybe sometimes seeming superficial by overt socialising, like air signs as well, though also with the additional characteristics of operating on instinct and appearing self assured and often quite composed individuals. But people I think mistake this wrongly for arrogance, and unfounded arrogance furthermore

This combination of easygoing-ness and somewhat impulsive attitude may make some people assume that there is nothing beneath this surface.
September 17, 2021 at 09:34
(Leo) Anni23 » Maiar
Thanks I´ll have a look at that website.

I have read that abput the sun actually.., it seems to almost be a general consensus. That you basically "earn" your sun.

I completely agree that I have seen that the moon in particular signs really inflates characteristics more than the sun
(I also have known closely a very intense Leo moon and Scorpio moon, at least the leo moon was good natured though)

Then I suppose that the house would influence greatly as well? Though people have different opinons on that

So eventually the sun and moon should cooperate? I think that I do feel friction between my moon and sun
My moon wants tp conceal a lot but then my sun is like "Why?" "You don´t really want to be like this or act like you care about people judging you"

Omg I am looking foward to my saturn return haha, though I know that people don´t often say that
September 16, 2021 at 23:00
(Sagittarius) Cosmette » Anni23
Funny you say that, my grandfather, a very smart Leo like yourself, said how intelligence in a person only goes as far as the person does for answers. No one will ever be dumb, no one will ever be boring, no one will ever be "too old" as long as they keep the childlike curiosity we had when we were young- questioning everything, taking in every little detail of the things we don´t know. The more we absorb, the more we have to say, the more we have to share, the more we have to learn. Suffice to say, perhaps I think you make a good point, curiosity may be a better term.
September 16, 2021 at 22:27
(Scorpio) OctoberScorpio » Anni23
I don´t use "Google" for information about numbers. Perhaps that´s why I truly don´t understand most of your comments about Numerology. There´s A LOT of misinformation online. . .
September 16, 2021 at 21:02
(Libra) Netyro
This is in my domain. You are absolutely correct in the belief that we all define intelligence differently. For the sake of this, I´ll define intelligence through familiar (to me) terms.

Analytical philosophy and continental philosophy are the two branches of philosophy. Analytical philosophy deals with more scientific and logic-based philosophy. So, philosophy of science, philosophy of language, philosophy of mathematics, etc. This is like Bertrand Russell, Ludwig Wittgenstein, Karl Popper, Thomas Kuhn, and Aristotle.


Continental philosophy deals more with "human" problems. Existence, meaning, experience. These are people like Camus, Kafka, Dostoevsky, Nietzsche, and Plato. This is the philosophy that dominates our literature, our film, our music, our art.

These two fields require separate personalities. Some can do one but cannot do the other. Very rarely can someone do both! Even more rarely does one care to do both.

In my opinion, I think that earth and air signs do best in analytical fields, whereas fire and water signs do best in continental ones.

So now that we´ve defined the two types of intelligences (Continental and analytical, or human and scientific), I think we can begin to look at particular houses and zodiac signs.

Fire and Water signs are the passionate, emotional signs of the zodiac.
Air and Earth signs are the logical, rational signs of the zodiac.

There´s some variation between them. Fixed being more analytical, Mutuable being more emotional, and Cardinal being somewhere in between.

So I think that on a purely archetypal basis, if a person has an earth or air mercury they may have a proclivity toward analytical intelligence. Depending on how its aspected, they may use their analytical intelligence in emotional ways. When I say this, I mean they may be analytical in their art forms, preferring objective art over subjective art. These people may prefer commentary-based art forms.

If someone has a fire or water mercury, depending on how it´s aspected, they may prefer more story-telling, personal art forms. Obviously, there´s variation, but I think this is generally true.
September 16, 2021 at 20:12
(Leo) STPFan
I´ve read some of the posts and wanted to throw in my 2 cents...

There really is no bearing if someone is more intelligent than someone else in regards to a Mercury Sign. How that said person correlates and expresses himself/herself is simply "element" related. How that person is being interpreted is based on your own Mercury sign or nearby planets (that said person directing communication towards you.)

So in regards to someone indicating Aquarius (AIR) Mercury is rather smart in math? I know a woman who couldn´t add 20 + 20 together. But, she can quickly spark up, approach, and angle herself to a proper sophisticated (witty) conversation that would keep you entertained for several minutes.

So with all due respect elements are the key role here... not necessarily the sign itself. How that said element correlates to your perception is the key. Everyone takes someone´s ideas differently.
September 16, 2021 at 18:17
(Sagittarius) natalizzye
I also have mercury in sagittarius;) I have many bad aspects, but despite everything I am a very intelligent, I never had to learn much to be the best in class. You mentioned the aspects of mercury with uran and mars, well I have two of them: mercury square mars, and mercury quintile uran, in general I think sagittarius, gemini and virgo are the most intelligent signs :117:
September 16, 2021 at 15:18
(Sagittarius) Cosmette » Travelguy35
It´s pretty broad, but since we all define it differently based on technical, emotional, and artistic skills, I want to leave it open for everyone to provide a pool of their own thoughts based on what they feel are their versions of intelligence and their versions of intelligent aspects! With mercury, I figure technical skills, but with uranus contacts I think it´s originality and artistic ability, and with mars is speedy intellect and wit!
September 16, 2021 at 11:35
(Scorpio) Travelguy35
Vague question.

What do you mean by intelligence? Loaded question. As you probably know there is social intelligence, emotional, mental, social, etc. etc. etc. So depending on what type of intelligence you are inquiring about, different things will be expressed in the chart.
September 16, 2021 at 04:36
(Leo) Anni23 » Cosmette
Well I knoe it from experience Saggitarians and Scorpios are committed to "the truth", and tbh these inclinations for investigation do often yield results..

Another thought.. libra and Aquarius I have found to be intelligent in terms of innovation/and fantasy

Memory is another component, water signs are said to have the best memory. I don´t know if I personally think that think is true however.. although it may actually be for picking up on key details, absorbing the undertone and seeing patterns

It´s possible that scorpio is rhe most astute of the signs. But then air/mercury isn´t far behind
I´m just thinking of someone I was researching the other day that combines all these influences, that you can see is very astute as I would call it, the actress and inventor Hedy Lamarr, no air or mercury! But Scorpio/8th/12th house placements, a lot of water and Pluto rising

Fire and water signs are intuitive, thats why many may act like they know things that they haven´t nessarily established how they should know
September 16, 2021 at 04:22
(Leo) Anni23 » OctoberScorpio
I dont need to explain it....

If your read my entire response you would see that I described "intelligence" as being multi-faceted and infact intersecting with wisdom and common sense in my opinon

Anyway just look the no 7 up on the internet and you will see a description that as doesn´t prescribe to traditional, clear cut definitions of intelligence

In my experience 11 is also a similar no

Not to be condensing this all too far, but I wonder often if curiosity/searching for answers/ would be a better word to use instead of intelligence
September 15, 2021 at 22:39
(Sagittarius) Cosmette » Anni23
Thank you for the response! I was afraid to mention my own placements because I didn´t want anyone to think I was exactly looking for affirmation on my own chart, but doesn´t mean I don´t appreciate learning something new about my chart when it´s given!!! Hahah I´m a Leo ascendant after all, so I´m here for it, thank you :^D you did kinda hit the nail on the head with learning more from observing. True to my Sagittarius stellium, I´ve travelled around the states a bit, hopefully soon out of country, but I learned more from being on my own than being told. Just more hands on. Although I don´t like language games too much, I do love to write, I LOVE it!

I think you´d be right about water signs, I´ve known a lot of Scorpios and Pisces and they´re always so wise and well spoken, especially with air placements. I´ve noticed Scorpio sun Gemini/Libra moons are very smart, one of my favorite podcasters Brene Brown has that combination and she talks a lot about psychology and our brains, and she can articulate in such a wonderfully fun and simplistic way, yet is incredibly insightful and introspective. My mother is a Scorpio sun and Aquarius moon, and when she wants to, she can hit the nail on the head with anything! I also have a friend with a Libra sun Scorpio moon and she is just... God, honestly? The most creative and intuitive girl I´ve met in awhile! I´ve met a lot of Pisces stelliums, a sun to mars, sun to jupiter, and a sun to venus, all different ages, but all very understanding and intuitive, all very concerned for the welfare of others, and have a wisdom which can´t really be denied, honestly.

I tend to notice both Leo mercuries and Cancer mercuries can come across as know-it-alls at times, my grandmother being one of them, but- uh- she actually *knew-it-all* she was a walking encyclopedia! With influence of Leo mercury in 1st, no doubt. She was the first of her generation to actually be a woman who went to school, and she traveled so much! Leos seem to also have an amazing intelligence, with that being said, their creativity is unparalleled! One of my bosses also happens to have a Cancer mercury, though, and he´s so intuitive and smart, he has a memory like no other, ask him any math question too and he looks up into his head and just rattles off the number. I call him the human computer :^)
September 15, 2021 at 22:20
(Sagittarius) Cosmette » theycallmetym
Interesting you say Uranus in 1st house! Would you tell me more about that? I have heard of mercury performing well in 1st, 3rd, 6th, and 10th, I did date a Virgo mercury in 1st for sometime and he was honestly stupid smart. He could easily assess anything in a quick glimpse. But since it´s a Mars house that you mentioned Mercury doing well in, it makes me more curious about this idea I´ve had of Mars zodiacs performing well in Mercury!
September 15, 2021 at 22:18
(Sagittarius) Cosmette » astreo
An interesting response as well! I figured the start of the question really developed once I challenged my thoughts on what exactly made either of the two air and earth signs domicile in mercury, and since I´ve been reading your responses I´m glad that I asked. There´s so many layers it seems to what makes one perform well mentally. I think redefining what mercury means in terms of thought and speech has been illuminating, thank you for your input there!
September 15, 2021 at 22:14
(Sagittarius) Cosmette » Maiar
I referenced this talking to a friend about it earlier! I thought this was so interesting to read, and I think it really resonated! I´ve met so many Pisces suns and Pisces mercuries who are just so quick witted, but also very fair and accepting. I believe the book I read called "Sun Signs"?(I may have forgotten) mentioned how Aries is the first to start in our maturation, and Pisces is the ending... seems fitting considered the domicile houses! Pisces would seem very wise in Mercury, it is selfless and understanding, although perhaps a bit murky. Still, I think anyone I´ve met with a Pisces Mercury to date seems intellectual and smart in their respective fields of study, usually it´s not as technical as Aquarius or Virgo, but they´re so creative and expressive in social welfare fields, theatrical fields, and in psychology.

It makes sense how you explain it though, even my partner and I tend to actually be flipped in the way we think! He tends to focus on bigger pictures, and I worry about the here and now... given, however, his mercury and sun are in the 9th, haha :´^)
It´s interesting how you mention moon signs, I feel I know a good handful of people who´s charts are highly aspected by the moon and they are rather quick! You´ve taught me something I never knew before :^0
September 15, 2021 at 17:57
(Leo) Maiar » Anni23
Thanks for your input, No necessarily traditional no,But this website is definitely the best at explaining everything about astrology especially the basics which is surprisingly neglected and not even mentioned in most astrology websites, My favorite :
southfloridaastrologer.com

A great explanation about modalities, Energy, moon, ascendant, The main difference between each sun and moon sign etc, And when u read this you will know how important the moon is.

The moon is actually who you are , You operate that way unconsciously, While the sun is who you are striving to be, You are conscious of your efforts to become the best version of your sun sign, But the moon is what you are from the inside, Without even trying.

Not only that, But the ssme sign operates differently when in moon or sun, It highly depends on the nature of the sign, Feminine or Masculine, Aries and Leo moons tend to be the most aggressive qnd angry, While naturally you woupd expect the sun to behave that way in leo and aries, and they are! But the sun needs to be pressed on by external force in order to show these traits of the most aggressive signs for example, Whereas the sensitive nature of the moon cant handle the raw fire of Leo or Aries which in turn places pressure on the native making them irritable and easily angered.

Its really interesting.
September 15, 2021 at 17:24
(Virgo) astreo
You are no less intelligent for having Mercury to the detriment in Sagittarius.
I´m also not smarter for having Mercury in Virgo.
We all have the same abilities.

The position of Mercury only reflects how you are going to process the information in your life and what focus you are going to give it.

If there were an exaltation of Mercury in Virgo as many say, I do not think it refers to the fact that the person acquires more "intelligence", because it is not like that, it is because Virgo gives Mercury that "perfectionist" capacity, it is In other words, Mercury in Virgo repeats and repeats and repeats and repeats and repeats the information until it is perfect.

A very clear example is the Medical area (which, Virgo is the main ruler). In Anatomy you have to learn thousands of muscles, nerves, joints, etc. very well. Someone with Mercury in Virgo is going to OBSESS with having all the information very precise, concise and clear. All medical teachers, when they take exams, are very used to stirring ideas and creating confusion, that is when Mercury in Virgo comes into action and begins to ORDER the ideas raised in order to organize the information and respond appropriately. It is something that another Mercury CAN do, but it is not his approach and, not for that reason, he is less intelligent, only that, he is not going to dedicate himself to that, he is going to excel in a different area.

I think that this is something that can be a Little annoying for other Mercuries, reading the same book thousands of times is not something that many are used to doing, of course, as everyone knows, the house and the appearance modify this.

A Mercury in Aquarius is more agile and fluent in math.
A Mercury in Aries has more speed and mental strength.
A Mercury in Sagittarius has more ideas and a bigger picture of everything.

No one is more "smart" than another.
This is my opinion and what I have seen about it.
September 15, 2021 at 17:06
(Scorpio) OctoberScorpio » Anni23
Explain why 7 would be “somewhat telling” ??

Why would this number “dictate intelligence” compared to other numbers.
September 15, 2021 at 16:23
(Leo) Anni23
Hmmm.. depends

Are we talking "logical" thinking and linear processes of collecting information

What do you consider necessary for a holistic understanding.

Arguably there needs to both the capacity to think independently alongside "traditional" aspects that indicate intelligence

Furthermore what are you picking up on?...
Of what relevance is ir to x. And what is the point of reflection?
Or is it just to gain knowledge for the sake of knowledge
People underestimate water signs and what/and how they are able to absorb information that is not necessarily evident or even empirical
Often these people´s conclusions are correct however

Though the problem with this of course is there is a risk of making assumptions that are unfounded based on a personal sense of acquired knowledge

Just looking at your chart I could see that you have mercury in aspect to pluto, overall I think this is a good aspect contributing to intelligence/inquisitoral attitude

Jupiter in the 8th too might mean that the knowledge you gain won´t be "exactly" empirical, but you will want to explore different angles and truths in this life

Your moon too should have a similar effect but more specifically to the point of having a good intuition
Being in your 11th I´d say gives you some edge in being able to communciate well with people too.
The 5th too

Could mean that your into word play/games involving language etc.

Ps. Noticed that your a numerology no 7, this is somewhat telling. I´d say that you should look at your other numbers too to get a more holistic picture
September 15, 2021 at 16:10
(Leo) Anni23 » Kuklacı
Why retrograde?.. :63:
September 15, 2021 at 16:09
(Leo) Anni23 » Maiar
This I found to be quite a good answer.
I have read about the chart and houses being divided according to these same divisions.

It´s very interesting what you say about the moon in ancient astrology!!
In any case I have my moon conjunct my mercury though

Whilst I have been meaning to look with a lot more in-depth consideration into ancient astrology, as quite frankly I appreciate the idea that people used to know a heck of a lot more than most of us do nowdays, I have not yet read that precise description of the moon.

Although I think it´s definitely not for nothing that people considered their moon sign as the moat important sign in ancient times.

Do you have any links to traditional astrology websites talking about the moon?

Haha funny that I have many "relationship signs" *eye roll.. I do find that I communicate very well largely due to this.
Though house placement still dictates the direction/pattern of holistic thought
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